Responses to personal story of “Faith Meltdown”
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č Just a quick note to say thanks. I love your work, and I am going back and reading what I missed. I am an evangelical escapee, an attorney, a man seeking the heart of God.
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č Wow. This was incredible. Two observations:
1. The
biography component of this was nearly as significant to me as the theology
component. Again I'm overwhelmed by
narrative and underwhelmed by concepts. The story of you and your dad at the
amusement part and getting campus-grounded for being a Calvinist are amazing
stories that show a nuance to the concept that the concept itself cannot
communicate.
2. But
the concept is amazing. I love how
you were able to "re-write in ink" which is perhaps the
"street" definition of theology. Many people practicing what they
think is Christian Theology today are actually
practicing Secular Philosophy-because they've moved past the blood issues. My question is can another person find a
DIFFERENT blood issue than you did? Can
they move past the Apostle's Creed? Can
they move to the Jesus Creed (like Scot McKnight does in his new book)? Can they move to Jewish Creedos
(as many are doing with the hip Christian "Torah Classes" these
days)? Can they move to the narrative
itself (the story we find ourselves in, for instance). Conceptually, I'm interested in that. Of course, if you can't say the Apostle's
creed, I think you and I would both say that you may be very spiritual, you may
in fact be following God with all your heart - but you're not really a
Christian in that you're following Jesus Christ whom you believe to truly be
the
Christ.
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č Actually, I'd have to think long and hard about when the faith meltdowns occurred in my life, because I wasn't raised in a Christian household -- at least not in a Christian household with a lot of rules. My family was nominally Roman Catholic, and smoking, drunkenness, swearing, swimming, movies, and Sundays as a day of rest and recreation were parts of my everyday life; I really had no "pencil-drawn" lines regarding Christianity. However, my main reason for writing is to thank you for hitting the nail on the head (once again) and sharing what I have found to be one of your best columns. I would like to have your permission to share it in my capacity as a pastor. I don't know exactly how. I likely would not make a "word-for-word" sermon or writing out of it, but I would definitely attribute anything I would use from it to you. We just had an extra-long Bible Study last night on "Keeping the Sabbath Day Holy" and I sure wish I would have read your "Meltdown" article before the Bible Study! Anyway, I just wanted to tell you how much I appreciate all of your articles, but this one in particular!
Editor’s Note: You are free to use any columns published on this web
site freely in your church.
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č You’ve NAILED it with this one. Homerun, three-pointer from double
coverage, Franco’s immaculate reception, whatever analogy works for you – this
one is excellent. (not to imply that others
haven’t been ;-) ) (Lifelong Nazarene
from Western PA, pencil and ink erased at Eastern Nazarene in Boston, now
living in Western PA wondering why I feel like a stranger in church
sometimes.
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č Oh, how I identify with your
article! The difference, though, in our experiences is that you have
advanced education degrees and are a man. I was raised in the Nazarene church
(very legalistic and strict in the 50's) and it was almost wrong to even
breathe. I do remember that my boyfriend in the 11th grade took me to a movie
about a sea monster and, upon exiting the theater, I
felt that the ground would open and I would descend into a literal hell. Fear
gripped me! God, in his mercy, allowed
me to eventually erase the pencil and ink things and get to the blood
things throughout the years. Some have called me "Yentl"
because I was always studying things that women "weren't supposed to be
interested in." Ah, the creeds! What blessing they brought into my
life. While I was living in Plano,
TX, Rev. David Roseberry of Christ Church Episcopal (www.christchurchplano.org
) wrote an excellent article on suffering that I wish every person
alive could read. At it's conclusion, he told of the
ordeals the writers of the Nicene went through to hammer out their faith in
that particular creed. I cried for two weeks when realizing that those beliefs
were indeed written in blood - that of Christ's and even some of their own. Now
nearing my 60's, I am so aware of God's leading on my
spiritual pilgrimage/journey and learning to appreciate much more fully the
richness of the Body of Christ. In our church, we say the Nicene weekly after
the sermon and occasionally say the Apostles' Creed. Always the words have
significant impact since Fr. Roseberry's teaching on
the subject. Even though I never attended seminary, God has enable me to study
and learn continually and for this I am most grateful. You are one of
those who I constantly learn from and am challenged to greater depths of
the faith. Thanks for your work and
witness,
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č Brother Keith, I cannot say if I ever had a melt down, but what your article has taught me was about Gods' Grace. Some of the best evangelists in my church smoke and drink. Yes, they are baby Christians, but this is where we see growth in grace and in numbers. I thank you again for your insight.
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č Just finished a closer read
of your latest Tuesday column. It was great to see the analogy pf
pencil-ink-blood played out in a story form. it
made the rubric far more concrete and hence more significant. The
analogy is not good in and of itself. Its power is in its proper use.
And you just put that proper use on display. The analogy can be abused
however: It could be used willy nilly to put either too much in the blood (e.g.,
even the most staunch conservative wacko can point to someone more fundy than themselves and say "well, I won't go as far
as him, but...") or too little
blood (e.g., classic protestant liberalism understood the "core"
idea, using the term "essence", but what they put in it was often
some kind of ooey gooey ethical Jesus-figure a la
Adolph Harnack's "What is
Christianity?"). Hence we
cannot just talk formally about the idea of a core in blood versus distinctives in ink and behavioral codes in pencil.
We also have to talk materially about WHAT is in the core, not taking it for
granted but really thinking about what goes in there and how we ought to think
about those things (e.g, a high christology, not just "Jesus").
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č Thanks for sharing
this. I think this is the most
personal of all your writings that I have read. More and more I am convinced that we as Christians
should focus on what we have in common and work together rather than
arguing about the "pen and pencil" issues.
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č I have
written you before. The piece you
published today is of great value to the church. I never had to live through your issues;
after my conversion I never lasted two months without going to a movie, and never
could feel sufficiently wicked about it.
But of course I had my own issues.
I am a little ahead of you; I graduated from college the year you
finished sixth grade. But that gap
has long since closed. Thank you. I am sure I will use the story of what your
father did for you, as will many other pastors. It really hits home. (Paul Rees was the great
gift of the Pilgrim Holiness Church to the Covenant and to the church throughout the world.)
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č Wow! Coach D, thanks for the post. I love to hear from people who have experienced things like these with such wisdom from retrospect so that I can look forward into my life to know what matters and what to spend my time on. I appreciate you and I appreciate your gifts. Thanks for being honest and effective. Some things are written in Blood, I thank Jesus that because of Him brothers are made through his Blood. Thank you for your impact on my life!
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č This is a tremendous story. Touched my heart. We had some of the same. Still hope we can hold on to some of the values for generations to come. Feed on the Scripture, keep praying to a God who loves us and is not out to zap us. We have a Pastor with high standards and still enjoys the teens and that proves him to me. THANKS FOR SHARING. BE BLESSED
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č I have not yet experienced the meltdown (although maybe leaving the Catholic Church counts...), but I think it's absolutely essential that we finally come to a place where we OWN the doctrines and beliefs for our own. Aside from being a pastor, I also teach at our local Christian high school. It's an inter-denominational school, evangelical in the basic doctrines. One of the things I stress to my students is that they must come to a point when they believe these things, not because their pastor says to, or even because their parents say they must, but because they are convinced in their own heart and mind of the truth of them.
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č Your pencil-ink-blood analogy, as well as your personal story, combined to make this one of the most helpful columns of yours that I’ve read to date. Thanks for being willing to be so transparent with your readership.
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č It is often hard to help students see and realize the truth you
described so eloquently. Many (on campus) talk too much about what
they are going to do without every trying to do it; thus, they postpone getting
a taste of true disappointment and faith exercise in the real (rather than
perceived) economy of God. Psalm 73 and the story of Asaph
rings so true with your observations about what our students face.
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č I don't want to stretch the analogy too far...and my thoughts on this are still germinating, but it seems to me as if the only appropriate thing to have in blood is a person. Blood and ideas don't mix. Blood and actions are not enough. Blood goes with people--living people. I wonder if the students who are falling away had a person in their blood category, or if that category held ideals. During college, I could have told you about Jesus being God, coming to earth, dying and rising for my redemption...I could have easily told you about Jesus' work. But I'm not sure I could have articulated the person of Jesus. I only could have offered vague answers as to why Jesus had to be God in order for redemption to take place. Yes, I believe the work of Jesus is in blood category. But that's not sufficient for sustaining faith. Jesus the person--who he claims to be--must first be in the blood category.
When the work apart
from the person is written in blood, we are left with something that lasts only
until we find a more appealing work. When the person of Jesus is
written in blood, we are able to see other acts and ideals that on the surface
seem greater than the earthly acts of Jesus, without having to reliquish what we have in blood. Blood and works don't go together.
Blood and people go together.
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č I'm a 40 year old minister who is not pastoring
now, mainly due to a meltdown of theology, ecclesiology and idealism.
Your posts over the past few weeks have really hit home to me, and I find
tremendous convergence with this week's. Thanks for giving implicit
permission to question, to reevaluate, and to think. After being out of the pastorate for 3 years, I'm just now to the point
of embracing the "Blood" items. I'm still a long way off
from settling the ink and pencil issues. Probably the one thing that
keeps me from "experimenting" further is my strong, loving wife who
listens and nods at my theological ramblings. She knows I have to talk
through things to get them settled. As you used to say, "Keep on
keeping on!"
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